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| Quote NickyKiss="NickyKiss"Great to have him back and I think he can now set a realistic goal of winning a World Cup (or at least making it past the group stage).
This England side looks to be developing nicely. It's getting better all the time, our player pool looks to be increasing and he brings some much needed top level quality to our back row.
If the Kiwis and Australia can get over our pack in the next few years that is likely to contain Burgess x3, Graham, Hill, Lockers, Walmsley, Roby, Farrell, Bateman etc then they'll have done well.
We look to be building something with the potential to be pretty special at the minute.'"
Agreed (well, apart from Lockers, I think this will be his last international series). We are in very good shape
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| We have a real quality England squad now and it's going to get better.
All we need is a quality coaching staff.
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| Quote Grimmy="Grimmy"Agreed (well, apart from Lockers, I think this will be his last international series). We are in very good shape'"
I wouldn't have included him but he says he's planning on playing on for as long as he's being selected.
Fitness permitting he'll play in next years four nations and the World Cup going off his comments.
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| Quote moto748="moto748"Maybe because (whisper it) Sam has to take some of the blame?
Bath didn't kidnap him and force him to play RU; he left of his own accord. I don't know what he imagined would happen to him in RU, he appears to have thought he could walk into the RUWC team with minimal delay (which he actually did, by hook or by crook). And then, hold the front page, it wasn't a roaring success. What a surprise!
Bath are playing him at his natural position. Which is fine. England played him at centre (where he had played for a bit, but was still a novice). He didn't do too much wrong as it turned out, and certainly can't be blamed for England's dismal showing. But I do wonder what SB's ideal scenario was, in his head, and how realistic that ever was.
And rest assured, he *will* be remembered as a "failed rugby league convert" by the English media.'"
He marked his opposite centre out of the game v Wales.
His own England centre partner (some ex South African whose name escapes me) was poorer than he was by some distance.
England were 10 points up when he left the pitch v Wales. He didn't enter the field until England were already well beat v Oz. He wasn't picked in the last game v Uruguay which you might have thought he would be to give him more experience given it was a dead rubber.
He was being lined up as the excuse as soon as England lost to Wales.
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| Quote DaveO="DaveO"He marked his opposite centre out of the game v Wales.
His own England centre partner (some ex South African whose name escapes me) was poorer than he was by some distance.
England were 10 points up when he left the pitch v Wales. He didn't enter the field until England were already well beat v Oz. He wasn't picked in the last game v Uruguay which you might have thought he would be to give him more experience given it was a dead rubber.
He was being lined up as the excuse as soon as England lost to Wales.'"
I think if you read the press reports no one is actually blaming Burgess. They are using his inclusion to highlight Lancasters poor decision making. That is another thing entirely. Burgess is running home because he didn't get things his own way.
The whole sorry saga is a mess. I'd have more respect for him if he stayed at Bath and learned the game properly instead of quitting. He must take responsibility for his own shocking decision making. Firstly for leaving League then for quitting Union.
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| Quote Aboveusonlypie="Aboveusonlypie"I think if you read the press reports no one is actually blaming Burgess. They are using his inclusion to highlight Lancasters poor decision making. That is another thing entirely. Burgess is running home because he didn't get things his own way.
The whole sorry saga is a mess. I'd have more respect for him if he stayed at Bath and learned the game properly instead of quitting. He must take responsibility for his own shocking decision making. Firstly for leaving League then for quitting Union.'"
There may be lots of sympathy being shown to him now but that doesn't excuse his awful treatment by some of the media and ex players earlier. There was plenty said about him that was way off the mark, a fact highlighted by Will Greenwod at least.
Also, whilst I agree he has to stand by his decisions made, your given reason for his about turn is simply your opinion I presume? Or has he told you personally? Another way of looking at it could be that he has been big enough to realise he had made a terrible blunder in the first place and has put things right.
Anyhow, it's all done and dusted now. Or would be, if Mick Ford would just shut up for once. He seems to be in the press every day yapping on about it.
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| Quote jinkin jimmy="jinkin jimmy"There may be lots of sympathy being shown to him now but that doesn't excuse his awful treatment by some of the media and ex players earlier. There was plenty said about him that was way off the mark, a fact highlighted by Will Greenwod at least.
Also, whilst I agree he has to stand by his decisions made, your given reason for his about turn is simply your opinion I presume? Or has he told you personally? Another way of looking at it could be that he has been big enough to realise he had made a terrible blunder in the first place and has put things right.
Anyhow, it's all done and dusted now. Or would be, if Mick Ford would just shut up for once. He seems to be in the press every day yapping on about it.'"
Mike Ford seems to have totally failed to grasp that Sam Burgess didn't go to Rugby Union to play for Bath.
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| Quote jinkin jimmy="jinkin jimmy"There may be lots of sympathy being shown to him now but that doesn't excuse his awful treatment by some of the media and ex players earlier. There was plenty said about him that was way off the mark, a fact highlighted by Will Greenwod at least.
Also, whilst I agree he has to stand by his decisions made, your given reason for his about turn is simply your opinion I presume? Or has he told you personally? Another way of looking at it could be that he has been big enough to realise he had made a terrible blunder in the first place and has put things right.
Anyhow, it's all done and dusted now. Or would be, if Mick Ford would just shut up for once. He seems to be in the press every day yapping on about it.'"
Burgess has been quoted saying he missed his family. Now where have we heard that before? Seems like every sportsman who wants to break a contract suddenly has bouts of homesickness.
The word hubris sums this up perfectly. Having conquered Rugby League he thought he could play an easier game and do just as well. I wonder if Sam spoke to Joel Tomkins about his experience. It seems that he took advice from those he wanted to hear from, Farrell, Ford and his agent, rather than some people who might tell him to think again.
Whilst his defence was always going to be good, his attacking skills were poor for inside centre. In fact with him being fast tracked into the team at the expense of better players, no wonder there was a backlash from within Union.
He went for the money and the glory, and who could deny him that? But as for whingeing about his press treatment, well, that's a bit lame IMO. If even someone as ignorant as me could see it, I really don't see why he couldn't. I posted at the time that Sam Burgess wouldn't make a Union star in million years and I was right. If I could see it I'll bet thousands of others could too. He ain't no Sonny Bill Williams. That much is clear from watching them both in the NRL. Why on earth he thought he could master Union in less than a year and play in a World Cup shows severe delusional thinking on his part and that of his advisors.
Mike Ford as Bath coach is asked questions by the press and he responds, that's his job. Why should he shut up? Mind you, I'm betting he feels pretty let down by Burgess, and the Chairman of Bath will too, who bankrolled the whole thing. Ford's advice was to stick around and make a flank forward and IMO Burgess should have done just that. He was on pretty good money for someone who is still learning the game.
We are yet to see how this will affect his RL career as well. No-one, apart from SBW, has actually come back to RL from RU and been as good.
FWIW I wish him well. Anyone can make mistakes. He has owned up to his. I hope that he becomes part of the England team that beats Australia next year. Of course we'll have to find some half backs first (maybe Johnny Wilkinson could come out of retirement and give RL a try? - which is about as fanciful as Sam Burgess smashing it in Union)
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| I would agree that Burgess never looked a good fit for Union from the get go as a back. I do think he could have made it as a flanker, but that is pure hindsight on my part. I don't for one minute think Bath signed him with a pack position in mind. Re Mick Ford and the press, he could always draw a line in the sand but instead chooses to prolong his own agony. Finally, to SB's credit he hasn't (as far as I know) complained about his treatment by either the press or pundits.
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| Quote jinkin jimmy="jinkin jimmy" Finally, to SB's credit he hasn't (as far as I know) complained about his treatment by either the press or pundits.'"
Why would he? The book will be out soon...... 
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| In this interview, Sam does have a dig at the union establishment/media & says his heart wasn't really in it. Fair enough, nobody thought he was going to Bath for any other reason but the money.
Looking forward to seeing him in an England shirt next year.
[urlhttp://www.sportinglife.com/rugby-league/news/article/480/10062653/sam-burgess-has-revealed-the-reasons-why-he-stepped-away-from-rugby-union[/url
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| I have some sympathy with Ford with losing Burgess, but he's certainly tried rewriting history in terms of saying that he always intended Burgess to play in the forwards. If you look at his comments when Burgess signed he said that England saw him as a centre but he was open minded about it. Which in hindsight is truly incredible. Whilst Burgess should have been smart enough to admit he'd never be a centre (in either code), it really beggars belief that a coach would go along with signing a big money, big name player and not actually know where he'd play.
The spite from ex-players, and now Ford (and seemingly Bath players in general or the captain at least) may affect some RL players' view of going to RU, but probably the more important longer-term effect will be the fact that England will never fast track an RL convert again. That means that even outside backs would face playing just club rugby for a year or so before being considered by England. That makes going to RU a very different proposition, and pretty much all about money. Burgess for sure never went to play club rugby - he wanted to be part of the RUWC and play internationals at Twickenham. No doubt Joel Tomkins, Henry Paul and Farrell Snr did the same.
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